E-mail updates
Follow on Twitter
Subscribe to RSS
Juicy Development
Police Scanner is available for $2.99 in the iPhone App Store.
Matthew A. Hale, 29, was arrested last week in Muncie, Ind., after he allegedly fled the scene of a failed stickup at a pharmacy.
Police accused Hale of being the getaway driver for an accomplice who was supposed to rob the pharmacy. But Hale drove off when things went sour, only to be stopped and arrested shortly thereafter, they said. Bail was set this week at $25,000 on felony charges of attempted armed robbery.
It's all pretty run-of-the-mill stuff, except for one thing: How did Hale know the heist was falling apart inside the pharmacy as he sat outside in the car?
How did he know to take off?
Matthew Hale, it turned out, had a smartphone — specifically, a Droid from Verizon Wireless. And on that Droid he had an app that he used to monitor Muncie police radio traffic, Detective Jim Johnson said.
If you're one of the millions of smartphone users who've downloaded scanner apps with names like iScanner, PoliceStream and 5-0 Radio Police Scanner, pay attention:
You might be breaking the law.
Hale, in fact, was initially charged with a second violation, unlawful use of a police radio, which is a misdemeanor. Court records show that prosecutors chose to go ahead only with the felony attempted robbery charges when Hale goes to court in July.
That doesn't change things for Detective Johnson. "The statute is that if it's being used as a police radio, that's illegal to have," he told my NBC colleague Chris Profitt of WTHR-TV in Indianapolis.
50 states, 50 laws
Should you scrub that scanner app from your phone? It depends. The law, it turns out, is quite literally all over the map on whether it's legal to use scanner apps on smartphones.
"As you look across the United States, we have 50 different states, and every state has different laws on things like obstruction of justice," said Benjamin Wright, a legal scholar in data security and forensics technology at the SANS Institute in Bethesda, Md., which teaches law enforcement and other security personnel the ins and outs of technology. (An earlier version of this post misspelled Benjamin Wright's name.)
It is legal to own a police scanner radio; on that, pretty much everyone agrees. Where things get sticky is when you take it out of your home. The problem, police and legal experts say, is that if you have it with you — in other words, if it's a mobile police scanner — then you can use it the way Matthew Hale is accused of: to aid in the commission of some other crime.
At least five states — Indiana among them, along with Florida, Kentucky, Minnesota and New York — make it illegal to use a mobile police scanner without a license from the Federal Communications Commission (i.e., a ham license) or permission from local law enforcement.
At least seven others, somewhat tautologously, make it illegal to use a mobile scanner explicitly in the commission of another crime. (They're California, Michigan, New Jersey, Oklahoma, Vermont, Virginia and West Virginia.)
In all of those states, a bewildering array of conditions and exemptions may apply: Is the radio "installed" in a vehicle or simply carried? Is it just a relay for a fixed radio? Perhaps you're a journalist on assignment — if so, you're all set in Indiana and Florida, where you're otherwise supposed to have an FCC license or the cops' permission.
'You could be at risk in any state'
The rest of the states don't clearly address the issue at all. That's because the laws were written in an era when "police scanner" meant a bulky box costing several hundred dollars that you could buy only at Radio Shack. They didn't envision a time when anyone could push a button, download an app and begin listening in immediately.
The apps don't even turn your phone into a true scanner. Instead, they receive feeds from police, fire and EMS channels all over the country, streamed over the Internet — and over your cellular network — to your device. You don't need to be in radio range, or even in the same state, for them to work.
"The technology is Buck Rogers stuff that nobody had heard of or thought of at the time the law was written," Wright told me. "This is the latest example of old laws bumping against new technologies where the application of the law is not clear."
"The outcome can often be a checkerboard, with very similar laws from one state to the next but different outcomes," he said. "In one state if you make it to a court, the court will rule it doesn't violate this law. Another court in another state will rule it does."
Until then, unwritten laws on obstruction of justice could apply, and that could be bad news for developers and customers alike, because "that is a general common law that doesn't have to be written down in any legislation," Wright said. Which means that "to the extent that you are using some type of app that is interpreted as obstructing justice, you could be at risk in any state, even in a state with no particular legislation."
While it's smart for app makers to include a warning in the terms of service to check your local laws, "I could envision somebody taking a hard-nosed attitude against these app makers regardless of them having these disclaimers and some prosecutor taking a position that these things are an obstruction of justice," he said. "I can envision a prosecutor trying to indict the app makers.
"It's something for an app maker to think about. You're making 5 bucks a pop for making these apps, and you've suddenly got a criminal indictment. That is not fun to deal with."
More cases could be likely
And it means things will keep happening like what happened to Cory C. Todd of Louisville, Ky.
In November, Louisville police charged Todd with possessing a mobile radio "capable of either receiving or transmitting radio or other messages or signals used by law enforcement."
Todd had three scanner apps installed on his phone when police searched it during their investigation of an unrelated case. He wasn't even using them at the time — he simply had them on his phone.
(Court records don't make it clear how that charge might eventually be resolved. The question of whether police had probable cause to legally search his phone is an entirely separate, equally thorny issue.)
So far, cases like Hale's and Todd's are very rare. The apps have been on the market for only a couple of years. But it's likely that more cases are on the way, because the public likes the apps and the police don't, and the laws are squishy.
The apps may be illegal in Indiana, but "I'd rather be safe than anything else," said Eugenea Jones Bare, a homemaker and mom in Muncie. "I'd rather have my kids safe."
But Jim Johnson, the Muncie detective, was just as determined. People shouldn't have the apps, he said, because the bad guys are simply going to "use that to assist in their crimes."
More on crime and smartphones from msnbc.com:
- Umpire strikes back over 'stolen' iPhone
- Was Facebook and 'Places' burglars' roadmap?
- Charles Manson had cellphone under prison mattress
Follow Alex on Twitter at @MAlexJohnson, and join the conversation at Technolog's Facebook page.
Leave a Comment:
Most apps that I know of only play the non-secure police channels. Police also have secure radio channels known as trunk channels in which you would need a more expensive scanner to listen to. These trunk channels are not available on the scanner apps. So, I do not believe that anyone should get into trouble for listening to the non-secure channels. If the cops don't want people to hear whet is being put out, then they should switch to the more secure channels.
Not so i am sorry to say as the way i read the article the app is set up to monitor a stream from somplace else ..and there are a couple of websites that can provide it even trunked radio coms..
i live in newjersey and alot of law enforcement here has gone digital but even that wont sway the criminal element from listening in. but they use there cell phones here more for coms than there radios here and go figure we have a law against cell ph use while driving it seems the law is one sided here in those regards. but as the technology advances in radio coms so will the scanners to monitor them and yes theyll become more expensive but if the crook wants or feels the needto acquire one they will hell they might even steal it. but as a ham radio license holder it is convieniant to monitor radio traffic in the truck (road closers)ect, but i also like to know what is going on around me or get an early heads up to a possible emergancy
I wonder how many lives might have been saved In Joplin, MO last week if more civilians had been able to listen to emergency services.
Like most efforts to punish misdeeds, the obvious knee-jerk reaction to make all such use illegal would actually cause more harm.
Would he have been legal if he had a scanner listening to ADT Alarm dispatch? How about the local newspaper, if he somehow could listen to the city desk editor dispatch a reporter to the pharmacy because of a report of a crime, would that also constitute misuse of police scanners? I doubt it.
As usual, efforts to squelch public use have negative effects, which in some cases might outweigh the intended result. Criminalizing the citizen's rights as a means of reducing crime is usually a bad idea.
How about better police work? More police? Community policing? Those positive results will not cause harm to the citizens who like to listen to crime reports on police dispatch.
I am one who, for years, used a Radio Shack scanner to listen to Fire, Ambulance and Police in my county. On several occasions it has helped me avoid streets where public emergencies were happening on, but in a really bad weather event I would want my wife and kids to have access to a scanner and to use it to save themselves.
Too many people turn to cell phones in a civil emergency and using a one-way system such as scanners actually is much better, as anyone can listen.
Please decriminalize legitimate scanner use.
Please stress the value to the community to leaving police dispatch unencrypted and available for the public who PAYS for the damn system in the first place!
Interesting how it is different all of a sudden then other issues. We keep hearing that "criminals are going to get and carry guns anyway, so stop passing laws that effect legal gun owners." But now they are saying nobody should have this apps to listen to what is happening in their community. This seems like a BIG double standard. Are the cops just not wanting people to hear them pulling over speeders all the time?
The argument that we should outlaw anything a criminal "could" use in committing a crime is ridiculous. What really cracks me up, though, is that the people making these arguments are the same people attacking every bit of social progress as an attack on "freedom."
With freedoms come consequences. Maybe in this case, one consequence of the freedom to listen to police radio is that bad guys can do it too. I'm completely OK with that. In this case, as in so many others, the benefits of this freedom outweigh any negative consequences.
Remember when the LAPD beat the crap out of Rodney King and all of a sudden camcorders were confiscated at 'crime' scenes?
It takes 2 to tango...
If the police do not want people listening in then they should stop streaming their radio calls over the internet. To make it illegal to access information that is freely available over the internet is not right. Also, the police have secure channels that they can use for information that they do not want intercepted. If a person is illegally buying a police radio, that is one thing. However accessing information that is broadcast over the internet with no security should not be illegal. It would be far simpler for the police to control the source of the information, either by not broadcasting it to start with or by protecting it with readily available encryption technology, than to go after people on the receiving end.
@TOOUNCOMMON while i completely agree that legitimate scanner use should be legal everywhere and 'could' serve to forwarn people of an emergency I happen to have lived in Joplin. The ready availability of these scanner feeds is just as easy there as anywhere; generally speaking almost no one you ask on the street understands that they are restricted, they just think you cant use them to beat the cops (i.e. obstruction); and those warnings and sirens go off all the time, most days, even if it's not a weekly test day, folks go about their business and treat the warnings and air raid sirens as a notice that they should check the wheather next chance they get. So I don't think scanner laws are what prevented those people from escaping, I think a lack of places to escape to from such a God-like storm played the biggest role in the death toll.
Even the radio shack portable scanner i have won't pick up the current police sqwak. must be a encrypted channel. I still get fire and ambulance though, and the local drive- thru's...lol
So, because the bad guys can use the apps for illegal activities, lets make or interpret old laws that will punish everybody. Never mind the safety aspect of the apps. Now that's settled, what about all those cars, guns and knives the bad guys use? Outlaw them also? C'mon legislature dudes, can't you people (with all of your staff), sunset some of this crap, or at least update it to this century. We have too much government with employees who are just drawing a check because the taxpayers and their representatives are making policy that chases away good employees.
Maybe the American public deserves what they get.
i deserve what i get, which is a heads up before the fuzz arrives if my dbag neighbor calls in a noise complaint.
If someone's complaining about your noise, maybe it's you who is the dbag?
Oh no, couldn't be, huh?
If they catch you smokin they're bound to drop the dime. insufferable informer crazy fools, wait with they're fingers crossed for you to break the rules...
no, we will only outlaw them when they are used agaisnt law enforcement. Anything that levels the playing field between you and the excessively agressive armament that the police will bring to bear on you should you cross them will be made illegal. So since they already have the equivelant of artillery when compared to your other, personal defense, items you won't have to worry about their unesscesary regulation. :)
I've heard it said that "the American public seldom gets what it deseves. It usually gets what it resembles." But, don't remember who said it.
What we need is a level playing field. Some of us like to keep it in the car and listen to upcoming accidents to re-route our driving directions. Hell! I used mine while driving a tow truck to get a jump on calls for tows. Remember radios are tools like a gun it's the operators which break the rules. Agreed?
I'm a little surprised that most of these comments actually make good sense for a change.
Why do they assume that people who like to listen to scanners have criminal minds? Maybe I'd just like to know which neighborhoods to avoid.
The People have the inherent Right to know what their Civil Servants are doing, at any given time. If technology, that is readily available to the People, is being used to commit a crime, then the perpetrator of the crime should also be charged for the misuse of the technology. The government(s) cannot take away Rights that were not given by them... Nor should they be allowed to restrict them.
Aye!
Spiddas...just saying. There are no "inherent rights".....people talk like that in spite of a world experience that shows no inherent rights to anything exist in our socieity.
Plus...in addition to our "rights" we also have "responsibilities"....somehow the two seldom come up in the same discussions.
So... our founding fathers were just kidding when they wrote that stuff about "inalienable rights"?
I don't have an opinion on the scanner app issue, but my jaw hit the floor when I read your post.
Some people need to get some inherent lefts to go with their inherent rights. Right in the kisser!
In Indiana, where this case happened, their Supreme Court just ruled that you can not refuse entry into your home by police for any reason! No warrant or anything, no question about having a justifiable cause, they just request entry and you can't refuse. This is the second similar ruling they made in the very same week!
And this is a "bright" Red State with a very active Tea Party movement! I can't stand the hypocrisy of these "anti-government intrusion" conservatives who have no problem in restricting rights and intruding where they feel appropriate. Indiana is becoming one of the worst with this kind of thing. Thankfully their Governor Mitch Daniels has decided not to run for President because he'd have gotten a lot of support from the right wing, who really don't know the details of what he and guys like him have inflicted upon our citizens.
John-1425001
I think you are talking about china...
Indiana needs to get their heads out of their butts----the police where i live are extremely corrupt ( yes some are honest and lay their lives on the line) They do not even have a college degree and only need a GED and a few months of training. I know several guys that dropped out our senior year of high school and now ....they are cops ( of course) We have issues with cops planting evidence in our homes ----I would never EVER allow this. Indiana you need to vote your officials out of office.
I heard about this a few days ago through a PPD legal service we've used in the past. Though I'm not an Indianan, it's more than likely that the judges are ignoring the Indiana Constitution and that the case in question may be in the process of proceeding to their US district court.
Peace officers should never have more authority than a true LEO. The biggest problem with society today is that the People have become way too complacent and way too ignorant to know how to contain those powers and keep them in check.
Like svopilot stated in post #6.0:
Only the police have power in a police state.
How many people are murdered by excited SWAT types every year serving no knock warrants on the wrong house? How many cops are charged?
How many lies are told on the stand by LEO's? How many are charged?
Power corrupts, therefore they are corrupt.
I recently saw this on a "De-Motivational" poster on the web:
They have forgotten that they too are Civil SERVANTS who are supposed to be working for US...
Svopilot: I think the quote your looking for is:
Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Great men are almost always bad men."
John Emerich Edward Dalberg Acton (1834–1902).
also:
"Unlimited power is apt to corrupt the minds of those who possess it"
William Pitt the elder.
svopilot, why don't you tell us how many instead of turning this into a homework assignment? Rhetoric is not facts! Convince me!
Unlike yourself, if more people had done their homework, especially in government and civics class, perhaps we wouldn't need to be educating you now! Your petulance serves only to reveal your ignorance. You do not need convincing; you need an attitude adjustment.
Once again, only in our wonderful country can something be taken away from people who don't abuse it, because of a small group that do. Can't imagine why this country is so screwed up!! Unbelievable, and we continue to let it happen. We might as well just all crawl under rocks now, because they will just keep taking more rights away as long as we continue to let them.
I am happy to be quoted in the article, but my last name is Wright, not White. --Benjamin Wright
Hopefully, someone will update that.
This was completely my error. It's been fixed with an editor's note added. Many apologies, Ben, and thanks for all your help.
"But Jim Johnson, the Muncie detective, was just as determined. People shouldn't have the apps, he said, because the bad guys are simply going to "use that to assist in their crimes.""
This is the same mentality that's been used to strip law-abiding citizens of their Constitutional rights to keep and bear arms: because a few people are bad people, NO ONE should be allowed to use/have/ or do it.
If people like Johnson continue to get their way, you're going to find yourself arrested for walking NEXT to someone that had that app installed, because it's possible you could overhear a police radio and think about doing something bad yourself.
It's time to take back America while we still have an America to take back.
And by force of arms, if necessary.
screw the cops do what you want. its a free society and if the cops don't support freedom, then the cops are the problem. We own the republic, not the other way around. we can listen to them if we want to,
in a car
or in a jar
one cop two cop
red cop blue cop
if they protected the people instead of the corporations we might have a better view of the cops...if they were not allowed to kill people with their tazers for 'not obeying" we might have a better view of the cops...if they didn't break into peoples houses...the wrong house murdering the wrong people and get away with it we might have a better view the cops...as it is, they are thugs with badges and lie to protect each other no better than a mexican street gang...
Disappointing that people have that opinion of the police. They are people, too. They aren't perfect, but I think most of them are good people trying to do right and make good decisions most of the time. Sure, there are bad apples in every barrel, but that shouldn't keep someone from trusting a cop when one needs to.
It's only the job of police to enforce the laws that are on the books. These things aren't made up on the spot. Lawmakers try to create new laws to get their name associated with for a "look what I accomplished" reelection ad campaign. That's what has turned us into a nanny-state, and are the real problem in my book.
On top of that, while police arrest for crimes, prosecutors decide which ones to use to press charges. Interpretation of the law comes down to the courtroom, not the cop on the sidewalk.
Not every cop is a good cop, but as a whole they deserve our respect. I'd hate to think what the drug lords, theives, rapists, and child molesters would be doing in our society if the police weren't around.
i usually agree with that - then again every now and then, while listening to the local scanner feed, some cop will leave his mic open and you get to hear what they really think. not usually a good thing to hear if you want to continue respecting cops...
Lotta whiners in here today. Remember this... ONLY scumbags and criminals hate the cops. It would appear many of them hang out here. LOL.
I agree august. I wouldn't go as far as to say do what we want. That's a little excessive. What I agree with is that cops are a sickening bunch of subhuman scum. Laws DO NOT apply to them at all. No Random, they are not people. If in fact they are people, they are mentally deranged with a godlike complex. I started losing respect for those abusive murderers many years ago. These days I have zero respect for them. I absolutely do not trust them. Even if you are the victim of a crime they will treat you as the suspect then proceed to harass and threaten you. Especially if you are an 85 year old grandma. They really enjoy tasing them and stomping on their throats. If you have absolutely no personality and enjoy murdering and abusing innocent people for fun, become a cop. The FOP is the biggest crime syndicate in this country. That's just my opinion and if you still think they're here to serve and protect you, that's your right. For now. Until the right to have an opinion is taken away from us too. I do not believe they are protecting us. We need to be protected from those assigned to protect us. Guilty until proven guiltier. Or is it more guilty. Either way you're not innocent. Time to reign in some of their authority before more innocent people and their pets are murdered by these heartless bastards. Just go to youtube and search police brutality to see how wonderful these so called people are. Obviously Madmac is oblivious to what's going on in this country/world.
Cops make streetside decisions as well so what are you talking about? A cop can be a real jerk penalizing someone by towing their car for something as minor as a tinted window ticket. The law says that windows can't be however dark, but what is the logic behind this law? NONE! However, the cop can either disregard it or act on it. Some things are their choice. The jusge only comes into play AFTER the cop makes the arrest
And one more thing RandomB, we live in a society that says that a drug lord will do 25 years in prison for a crime that is not forced or violent, but a child molester gets 10 years probation. Does this really make sense? I don't care what the non-violent drug lord's as you call them run around and do. They didn't put the syringe in anyone's arm. If they had 20 kilos of heroin to sell with no addicts, they couldn't sell squat! Understand. Choice is the key word here. They killed no one, but serve time like they did. Child molesters forced these children to have an awful, hard life. I don't support these types of nonsense, prove a point laws and the police that abide by them!
I wholeheartedly agree that several laws on the books make no sense, and it would piss me off to no end to have a cop write me a ticket for slightly tinted windows. But, if I choose to have my windows tinted I am agreeing to take that chance. And again, if our lawmakers weren't creating stupid laws a lot of these problems wouldn't exist!
I can't agree with your logic about the relative harm certain criminals cause vs. the punishment they get. A child molester with 10 years probation?? I think about 30 years ago those sentencing laws were light, but I would imagine they've been made a lot harsher since then. I'd even support the death penalty for those peices of ****. As for drug lords, you're ignoring the number of people that are harmed or killed just in getting the drugs to the streets. Non-violent?? Have you not been keeping up with the escalation in violence with the Mexican drug cartels? You don't think their infiltration & corruption of the Mexican government causes problems for the safety and economy of Mexico, and doesn't affect the immigration problem we have here in the US?
I said non-violent for a reason. There are the Mexican cartels that breathe murder and mayhem and then there is your corner hustler that just wants to feed their family. And just like you signed up for a ticket for a tinted window, the mules and other participators signed up for violent lashbacks. Again the word choice. And that is why I said non-violent... And I have seen people with little to no criminal history face 13years in prison just trying to feed their family. And I've seen all too recently, a man get 10years probation for molesting a child. And at MadMac. I am neither a scumbag or a criminal and I still hate the police. And you loser!
One more thing, I stated that I do not support prove a point laws, not laws that actually have validity. Yes, I totally agree that infiltration has caused problems for the safety of the Mexican citizens, but the corruption of our government concerns me more. Do you realize the violence is because, for the last 20something yrs, the US has allowed Mexico to do what it was doing as far as the drug trade was concerned. Now all of a sudden, their easy pass has been removed by a leader TRYING to MAKE IT LOOK GOOD, and they're angry. Money money money money. I'm in the trenches. I see what's going on. Stop being so clueless. Politics is about cash and corruption.
The bad guys will use the apps, or any technology for that matter, to improve the chances of a successful crime. Laws like that only keep honest people honest.
First, the courts interpret the law, not detectives. The law as written in almost every state except 2 make it a crime to use a RADIO in commission of a crime. The laws do not say you cannot have a police radio. Second these are not radios. Sounds like a technicality, and it is, but it is one that the courts recognize. The legislatures will need to update the law or it will be nearly useless in regards to smartphone apps.
lastly you got to love the detectives reasoning why no one should own one, because bad guys can use them. So are you saying that we should also not own cars because a bad guys could use one to commit a crime? How about butter knives? Once read a news story about a a guy who committed a robbery using a frozen turkey, do we need to switch to ham on Thanksgiving now?
Technically a cell phone is a 2 way radio. So the law most likely applies.
Love the word "technically". Because "technically", a cell phone is not a radio. A radio transmits using radio waves. A cell phone uses microwaves. A significant difference also in the way they are used since radio waves can be picked up and listened to by anybody.
You are so clueless, Microwaves (including the cell bands) ARE radio waves. You might want to investigate what "DC to Daylight" means.
BTW- Ham radio operators have parts of the microwave spectrum. 1.2, 2.4 gigahertz and above. Well above the cell phone bands. We use it all the time.
Radio tech for 35+ years.
Cool. Thanks for the information.
If big brother needs to know where we are, why shouldn't we know where HE is? Possessing or listening to a scanner app cannot be considered prima facie evidence of promulgation of obstruction of justice ! further........searching my heavily encrypted cell phone would be an extremely slippery slope!
it appears to me the app. prevented a crime from being commited, i see nothing wrong with that.
Intriguing perspective, Brian !
No, the accomplice inside the store still tried to rob it. The app didn't prevent that. The driver used the app to realize the police had been alerted and were on their way.
So......?! he still got caught! Evidently his app wasn't that great
Jim Johnson, the Muncie detective, was just as determined. People shouldn't have the apps, he said, because the bad guys are simply going to "use that to assist in their crimes."
Soooooo... When scanner apps are outlawed only outlaws will have scanner apps.
Do the cops think making these things illegal will keep them out of the hands of criminals? One more charge, give or take, isn't gonna deter them from their crimes...
The most popular phones have restrictions on where and how you can retrieve applications. Further, the manufacturer retains control over the applications on your phone and can literally remotely delete the data.
Only Apple does that. Android, not so much (or at all, really). I have rooted and unlocked my phone, and I have a custom ROM for my OS, called Cyanogen, and I just checked a little box that let's me install apps from anywhere (which you can do with a factory OS, too), not just the Android Market. None of which is illegal. That's why Android is more popular with those of us who have some technical aptitude, who like to tinker with, customize and optimize our own technology, as opposed to having someone do it all for us in Cupertino (and therefore retaining the kind of corporate "Big Brother" control you mention). After all, it's my phone, I paid a lot of money for it, I can hack it however I want.
Wait, using a police scanner while committing a crime is illegal?? Oh man! I better call off that bank heist later this week, I wouldn't want to get into any trouble with the law!
lol
Police are "vexed". I'm surprised that most of them even know what that means. I would say, "Too bad." The problem here is that the police aren't allowed to interpret the law, but do anyway. They have been given almost unlimited powers by the same public they purport to protect, and use them any way they choose. They have virtually no accountability and, in this area at least, misuse their authority with relative abandon.
We have so many little 'napoleanic' states anymore - everyone is a criminal somewhere! Happy Meals in San Fran, Duck Pate in Chicago, Gay in Tennessee, Smoking anywhere in NYC, and the list goes on and on. We do not have WISE Leaders anymore, who have a conscious which they keep them in check. We have so many people making rules, justifying their existence placing their 'ego stamp' on as much as possible in order to show the world 'how good' they are. These types are called EGO Maniacs and it is a SUPREMACY type of rule. DO EXACTLY AS THEY SAY - or you will be a criminal and PAY.
Freedom - yeah right - not in this century and it has been underminded since 1940's when nazi germany secretly infiltrated the US Government. And this is why America has been destroyed - Just like Rome - when the people SLEEP, the Wolves with Sheeps Clothing Destroy the very fabric of reality with their perverted need for Control and Dominion.
Honey, the Nazi's didn't secretly infiltrate the government. In fact their only true group of sabateurs were caught. They did (sadly) have a lot of sympathizers. And Freedom was being undermined since the Govt decided it owned all land, so it could then tax it. The problem we have and have always had is politicians. Politicians give themselves benefits, and receive payoffs from corporate and special interest friends. Take away the ability of politicians to screw us over and you'll fix the problem. Also take away the ability of Credit Agencies and Banks to fix your fate also and you'll remove another major problem.
Bored -- you should know you can't counteract rants with facts -- it's impossible. Nice try, though.
"The apps don't even turn your phone into a true scanner. Instead, they receive feeds from police, fire and EMS channels all over the country, streamed over the Internet"
Um...so STOP STREAMING THEM OVER THE INTERNET....
Isn't that a much simpler solution that would instantly make these apps worthless? Even with the actual scanners police frequencies should be encrypted. The radios in the patrol vehicles or carried by personnel should require a code to be entered every time the device is powered off before being able to listen to police channels.
What is so hard about this? Cell phones have this technology fer chris sake.
but the police have no right to privacy when in the process of their work. we are their EMPLOYERS, and as such have a legal right to question the ways they do their jobs. we have people getting arrested for taking videos of police, people getting arrested for using police scanners, and police that have decided unilaterally that they have the right to search our cell phones and computers without a warrant. all these things are unconstitutional.
SO - once upon a time it was clearly understood that the RF Spectrum [and all other "bandwidth' ] belonged to the PEOPLE [remember us, the suckers who keep putting idiots in positions of power . . . ] You don't need a license to listen to any radio anytime anywhere. Oops, they made a law . . .
WE are so screwed . . .
Love,
RandyC
These laws should simply not apply to cell phone apps since clearly no one is using a "radio" or "radio scanner" which is what the law is intended for
Apps such as these sure make it tough to beat the crap out of minorities without getting in trouble. Sure takes the fun out of being a cop.
Obvious TROLL is Obvious
Funny, but true, SDN! :-)
Try living in Indiana. Our wonderful state Supreme Court recently ruled that the police may illegally enter your house. No warrant or probable cause necessary. Guess we can always use the 4th Amendment to wipe our a$$es.
If the Supreme Court ruled for it, that would make it legal. Care to provide a link to details on your allegation?
I suspect a case against that will be in the U.S. Supreme Court soon. Of course, I've not read much about it, so I don't know all the details, but a cursory glance looks like it's clearly against "illegal search and seizure".
State law CANNOT supersede what is clearly stated in the Constitution.
I tried to include a link but it wouldn't let me. Google "Indiana Police Search" and see for your self
State law can not supersede what is in the constitution yet a state like Illinois say I have to register myself as a gun owner.
But that's not preventing you from owning the gun.
Okay, I found a link describing the incident that prompted the Indiana Supreme Court ruling. And, it's my impression that the cops were acting in the line of duty to force themselves into the residence as they had reason to beleive from observing activity outside the home, that there was a domestic violence issue going on. The Supreme Court didn't rule that police can enter a residence without reason or provocation. Illegal search & seizure is still against the law. What the court said was that the homeowner had no right to physically restrain the police, as they still considered that assaulting a police officer.
Sorry, if that had been my sister being beaten by her husband, I wouldn't mind the police forcing their way in. And if the police barge into my brother's home wihtout a warrant and arrest him for his potted plant, I'd advise my brother to sue them for all he can get.
So, once again we restrict the freedom of the 95% good law abiding citizens who use the app for safety or entertainment because of the 5% creeps that use it for illegal activity.
ARMYTango - Sorry, but trunk channels are NOT secure. Most scanners today are more than capable of doing both analog and APCO-25 digital trunked systems. In addition, these live scanner feeds DO have trunked systems on them. San Diego PD and Sheriff's Office are examples. The ONLY way law enforcement personnel can have secure communications is to have an encrypted system. Some agencies have done just that - Phoenix PD for example.